Learning Guidance

Cyndre · November 24, 2011

So I decided I wanted to learn web development and began researching, posting on forums for advice and buying books.

I have to self teach as I work long hours and can't leave work for full time or even part time education with attendance.

I'll be honest I feel like a dog chasing its own tail and in a few weeks have built up a patchwork knowledge of this fascinating field. But I need to stop chasing my tail and get some direction.

My goal is two fold:

1. Develop an Eve site that has integrated CMS (UMBRACO) and then use this as a platform to develop web based apps using eve's api. This in turn hopefully will provide me valuable skills to turn to work where I need to develop a web based event logging system that can then produce reports.

2. Become proficient with html > css > javascript and jquery > .Net with C#. I've more or less settled now on these languages in that order and feel .net is right for me and valuable for my work. Besides it'd be an easier stepping stone to learn Java or other languages after if needs be.

What I've done so far could be described as organised chaos! I bought:

Missing Manuals Creating websites

Sitepoints Build your own website the right way 4th edition

Sitepoints Build your own asp.net 4 website using c# and vb

Wrox programmer: Beginning asp.net 4

C# 2010 All-in-one for dummies

PHP and MySql for dynamic web sites

I have Visual studio express IDE's installed, netbeans, dreamweaver cs5.5 and have been hand coding in notepad at work!

But to be perfectly honest I feel stuck in the mud and learning from books is hard going and quite dry for me. I looked at Lynda.com but their asp course was for 3.5, then I saw killsites dvd's and they looked interesting.

I have a wonderfil library and not alot to show for it though I do know what my end goals are and to a point they are driving what I want to learn.

I created my design in photoshop and decided to have it professionally converted to html / css by markupbox and then reverse engineer it to understand how they did it and what it is comprised of. I then wanted to try integrated Umbraco CMS into this template.

So as you can see I think I've spent enough money but I'm going round in circles! Can anyone help set me straight on this as one thing I do know is I love this field and am excited at what you can do.

To give you an idea of what I'm upto in ability atm (that is what I can hand code in notepad with a bit of occassional forum help).

<!DOCTYPE html>
<html>
<head>
<meta charset="utf-8" />
<title>Visual Logistics</title>
<link rel="stylesheet"  href="style.css" />
</head>
<body>
<div id="container">
	<div id="tbar">
		<div id="tbcontent">
		Visual Logistics Interface...
		</div>
	</div>

	<!--Page header here-->
	<div id="header">
		<h1>Visual Logistics</h1>
	</div>

	<!--Navigation Bar-->
	<div class="nav">
		<ul>
		  <li>Event Management</li>
		  <li>Event Viewer</li>
		  <li>Crystal Reports</li>
		  <li>Support</li>
		</ul>
	</div>

	<!--All page content here-->
	<div id="content">
		<p>This is a prototype interface for event logging written in html and css on notepad</br>
		   Not everything has to cost a fortune to learn and develop!
		</P>
	</div>

	<!--Page footer content here-->
	<div id="footer"></div>

</div>
</body>
</html>

html, body, #container	{
 height:100%;
 margin:0;
 padding:0
 }

body		{
 background: silver;
 font-family: Calibri, Verdana, Arial, sans-serif;
 }

p, h1	{
 padding:10px 21px;
}


#content	{
 width:950px;
 height:100%;
 min-height:100%; /* this should make the #content stretch all the way down to the bottom of the screen. */
 margin:0 auto;
 padding:40px 0;
 font-family:Arial, sans-serif;
 font-size: small;
 background:#fff;
 }

#header		{
 width:950px;
 margin:0 auto;
 background:#fff url(image/grad.jpg) repeat-x;	
}

#tbar		{
 width:950px;
 height:40px;
 margin:0 auto;
 background:#484343;
 }

#tbcontent	{
 color:white;
 text-indent:21px;
 font-family:Arial, sans-serif;
 font-size: small;
 line-height:3em;
}

.nav		{
width: 950px;
margin:0 auto;
background:#fff;
}

.nav ul		{
margin: 0; padding:0;
float: left;
}

.nav ul li	{
display: inline;
padding: 21px 22px;
}

Sorry for the enormous post but I know I can do this, just need a little help.

benjaminmorgan · November 24, 2011

You should definitely check into joining the University or buying a DVD. The work that they have done on their youtube channel is amazing. Get a sample at the KillerPHP channel on youtube: http://www.youtube.com/user/killerphp

PicnicTutorials · November 24, 2011

I learned at http://www.lynda.com/. its cheap and when your done you cancel

falkencreative · November 24, 2011

Just as a word of warning -- if you do intend to continue down the ASP.NET path, I'm not sure quite how much the KillerSites videos are going to help you. They may be helpful for html/css/javascript knowledge, but the web development videos focus on PHP rather than ASP.NET. If you want to focus on ASP.NET specifically, then I'd suggest looking at lynda.com.

The best thing you can probably do at this point is to plan out the intermediary steps between now and your final goal. Figuring out what you want to do between then and now, and perhaps having a couple smaller ASP.NET projects that you can practice on in the mean time would be helpful. I'm not sure about you, but I tend to learn best when I have some sort of goal project in mind, and my learning revolves around what I need to learn to complete that project.

Also, I should ask... why ASP.NET specifically? And why not PHP?

Cyndre · November 24, 2011

Thanks guys, I was a little frustrated that Lynda.com's asp training's out of date using 3.5 and was put together in 2009.

I pretty much understand you need a foundation in html / css but from what I read of the asp books I own they seem to take an all in one solution in that you need to learn asp at the same time due to integration.

I definately work well with goals, the project I commissioned is literally a template html / css page from a design that I made and it will give me the freedom to use it as a technology base to learn asp and experiment with integration.

I did consider php but tbh I really love the visual studio IDE and I used to do VB programming many years ago having done a course on it so I'm comfortable with the language. I also largely stick to microsoft platforms.

It is also more useful for me to know asp when I turn my attention to developing the business application I've been asked to do.

falkencreative · November 24, 2011

A couple other resources you might want to look at:

http://www.learnvisualstudio.net/courses/

http://net.tutsplus.com/tutorials/asp-net/the-best-way-to-learn-asp-net/

Cyndre · November 24, 2011

Many thanks for that though it raises an interesting consideration.

Reading through the comments on the nettuts+ guide it seems they are suggesting that for someone just starting out on this road you are better going straight into MVC3 and Razor.

In principle this sounds great as the premise is that you have greater control over your markup and it simplifies the code.

This would be fab for me as I really am struggling to work out how to take my html / css template and move it into asp with dynamically loading content in the content pane.

MVC3 seems to solve this but....there does not appear to be any entry level MVC3 / Razor books akin to Beginning asp.net making it hard to jump straight into this path.

Certainly if I can avoid webforms it'd be great.

Any ideas or thoughts?

EDIT: Just saw Wrox Beginning ASP.NET Web Pages with WebMatrix. Would this be the magic solution?

falkencreative · November 25, 2011

I can't really give you any advice on this... My own knowledge of ASP.NET is pretty limited, and I've primarily stuck to PHP and PHP based frameworks and cms's. Hopefully you'll be able to figure it out. Perhaps someone else will be able to comment?

Cyndre · November 25, 2011

Hope so mate and thankyou for all the guidance.

Spent hours reading up on it and for all microsofts attempts to make it clearer and simpler it seems chaotic.

I think you start with Web page framework on the webmatrix IDE using SQL CE as a learning tool then if I read it right you migrate to MVC3 framework using web developer as the IDE and SQL Server 2008.

If so I've gone down totally the wrong path with web forms as that is more orientated to those migrating from desktop apps and I'm looking to go more pure web based development.

Tbh the more I read about it the more confusing it gets! Did order the new wrox webmatrix book though.

falkencreative · November 25, 2011

Tbh the more I read about it the more confusing it gets!

...And that's the reason I've stayed away from ASP.NET...

LSW · November 25, 2011

Keep in mind:

ASP is only a frame work, not a programming language. ASP is old, ASP.NET is currently used most.
ASP encompasses the use of an actual programming language, traditionally VB.
Most common now I think and used by my last programming job with the state, ASP.net with C#.
ASP.NET supports VB, C#, Java and can also support PHP & Python.

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