Comments on: Java’s dirty little secret: Java web hosting is fragile. http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/ Real world talk about web design, programming and the business of web design. Fri, 29 Aug 2008 03:08:02 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.3.1 By: Gavin http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-153823 Gavin Tue, 06 May 2008 17:27:11 +0000 http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-153823 they said they were setting up a cluster server. sadly it didn't ever work. they blamed our code so we tried numerous other download tests etc and nothing even came close to the page/image load that a cluster server should do. they said they were setting up a cluster server. sadly it didn’t ever work. they blamed our code so we tried numerous other download tests etc and nothing even came close to the page/image load that a cluster server should do.

]]> By: Stefan Mischook http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-92549 Stefan Mischook Wed, 19 Sep 2007 21:47:54 +0000 http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-92549 What? $7,000! What the heck did they do? Stefan What?

$7,000! What the heck did they do?

Stefan

]]> By: Gavin http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-92548 Gavin Wed, 19 Sep 2007 21:45:16 +0000 http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-92548 I'd steer clear or ubiquity hosting. they've been the worst move i ever made. After spending over $7,000 on setup fees their servers couldn't handle 150,000 page views per day let alone java! be very careful! I’d steer clear or ubiquity hosting. they’ve been the worst move i ever made. After spending over $7,000 on setup fees their servers couldn’t handle 150,000 page views per day let alone java! be very careful!

]]> By: Stefan Mischook http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-88043 Stefan Mischook Tue, 28 Aug 2007 22:20:56 +0000 http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-88043 Hi, "Tomcat on our intranet server for 7 years" That is the key; you having total control over the server. I ran Resin servers for years with no problems, it was only when I went to 3rd party hosting did I run into trouble. But I have to tell you, it has been about 2 years now that we've pushed a lot of our apps to PHP and something is strangely missing ... the server set up problems. Stefan Hi,

“Tomcat on our intranet server for 7 years”

That is the key; you having total control over the server.

I ran Resin servers for years with no problems, it was only when I went to 3rd party hosting did I run into trouble.

But I have to tell you, it has been about 2 years now that we’ve pushed a lot of our apps to PHP and something is strangely missing … the server set up problems.

Stefan

]]> By: Brad Cathey http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-88030 Brad Cathey Tue, 28 Aug 2007 21:09:02 +0000 http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-88030 My company has been using the same install of Tomcat on our intranet server for 7 years (yes, it is that old!). I think we have had to reboot twice because of Tomcat related issues in that period. I think everyone will agree that PHP is a good scripting language that can scale up well, provided caching. Web Services, and certain IDE benefits may not be a shinning area... I think everyone can also agree that Java (frameworks/implementations) have bumped the walls quite a few times before they got things straight (ie J2EE). The fact is you should make your choice based on your skill level and your project requirements (as always). Never base a solution on hype. If you do, you are destined to become a marketing manager someday! haha My company has been using the same install of Tomcat on our intranet server for 7 years (yes, it is that old!). I think we have had to reboot twice because of Tomcat related issues in that period.
I think everyone will agree that PHP is a good scripting language that can scale up well, provided caching. Web Services, and certain IDE benefits may not be a shinning area… I think everyone can also agree that Java (frameworks/implementations) have bumped the walls quite a few times before they got things straight (ie J2EE). The fact is you should make your choice based on your skill level and your project requirements (as always). Never base a solution on hype. If you do, you are destined to become a marketing manager someday! haha

]]> By: George Penev http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-73019 George Penev Thu, 28 Jun 2007 08:58:14 +0000 http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-73019 Ask your Private JVM JAVA provider for your max HEAP size? It is really uncomfortable question, as soon as it is not cost effective, to be unable to share unused memory, so only solution for your provider is to give to his customers small max Heaps. And if he delivers you about Heap about 2GB , it is sure most of the time you will use Slow Swap Memory, because thats the only chance for such solutions. Cheers! Ask your Private JVM JAVA provider for your max HEAP size? It is really uncomfortable question, as soon as it is not cost effective, to be unable to share unused memory, so only solution for your provider is to give to his customers small max Heaps. And if he delivers you about Heap about 2GB , it is sure most of the time you will use Slow Swap Memory, because thats the only chance for such solutions. Cheers!

]]> By: Party Midgets http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-65775 Party Midgets Wed, 13 Jun 2007 20:52:43 +0000 http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-65775 I've been using Java web hosting from http://www.ubiquityhosting.com for quite some time, and it's always worked just fine. If Tomcat is inaccessible once a week, I would really contact your host; something clearly needs to be fixed there. I’ve been using Java web hosting from http://www.ubiquityhosting.com for quite some time, and it’s always worked just fine. If Tomcat is inaccessible once a week, I would really contact your host; something clearly needs to be fixed there.

]]> By: Stefan Mischook http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-64570 Stefan Mischook Sat, 09 Jun 2007 02:34:29 +0000 http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-64570 Bill, How about we say php is a porsche and Java is a truck. ... Java is great if you have huge projects. But for most web projects out there, PHP will drive circles around Java. Bill,

How about we say php is a porsche and Java is a truck.

… Java is great if you have huge projects. But for most web projects out there, PHP will drive circles around Java.

]]> By: Bill http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-64543 Bill Sat, 09 Jun 2007 00:34:03 +0000 http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-64543 Comparing PHP to Java is like comparing a Volkswagen to the Space Shuttle. It's really sort of silly if you've had a lot of experience with both. PHP is a great scripting language but Just try building a large-scale Enterprise application, with complex business logic, using PHP. You'll end-up with an absolute mess and the performance will be nightmare because it will not scale. Someone mentioned Yahoo using PHP and that's great. But scaling a heavily trafficked web site is a whole lot easier than scaling a heavily loaded multi-tiered application with dozens or even hundreds of discrete components. That is where J2EE shines. I think it is very much true that PHP has a huge advantage over Java in a shared-web hosting environment. Classloader issues, security policy issues, etc make hosting multiple sites under one Tomcat instance very challenging and this accounts for the vast majority of down-time with Java apps in a shared hosting environment. Every time one user makes a code change the server needs to be restarted which, unfortunately, knocks everyone else off. This problem doesn't exist with PHP. But in a corporate data center environment where changes are tightly controlled, Java is at least as stable as anything else out there and MUCH more powerful than languages like PHP. Comparing PHP to Java is like comparing a Volkswagen to the Space Shuttle. It’s really sort of silly if you’ve had a lot of experience with both.

PHP is a great scripting language but Just try building a large-scale Enterprise application, with complex business logic, using PHP. You’ll end-up with an absolute mess and the performance will be nightmare because it will not scale.

Someone mentioned Yahoo using PHP and that’s great. But scaling a heavily trafficked web site is a whole lot easier than scaling a heavily loaded multi-tiered application with dozens or even hundreds of discrete components. That is where J2EE shines.

I think it is very much true that PHP has a huge advantage over Java in a shared-web hosting environment. Classloader issues, security policy issues, etc make hosting multiple sites under one Tomcat instance very challenging and this accounts for the vast majority of down-time with Java apps in a shared hosting environment. Every time one user makes a code change the server needs to be restarted which, unfortunately, knocks everyone else off. This problem doesn’t exist with PHP.

But in a corporate data center environment where changes are tightly controlled, Java is at least as stable as anything else out there and MUCH more powerful than languages like PHP.

]]> By: Stefan Mischook http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-49153 Stefan Mischook Mon, 16 Apr 2007 17:07:49 +0000 http://www.killersites.com/blog/2006/java-hosting-is-fragile/#comment-49153 "we have such high traffic demands that PHP alone without significant caching could not handle the load we get." Interesting comments and perhaps true. But, what makes you say that? Do you have personal experience to back that up? Thanks! Stefan “we have such high traffic demands that PHP alone without significant caching could not handle the load we get.”

Interesting comments and perhaps true. But, what makes you say that? Do you have personal experience to back that up?

Thanks!

Stefan

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